What is exactly definition of “witnessing of test” by 17025?

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Posted by Nhat Nguyen Duc (Discussions: 1, Comments: 2)
Replied on February 7, 2018 12:00 am
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Dear Duc:

Easy. It is someone watching the conduct of a test being done by one of the lab technical staff - one of the people who would normally do that test.

During an accreditation assessment, an assessor will view (witness) the test being conducted by the lab staff. This is a normal part of an assessment.

In the context of 7.1.7 of the 2017 version of 17025 it means: the laboratory shall provide a place to allow a customer to witness (view or observe) lab staff conducting tests on that customer's equipment (or samples).

This OK?
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Posted by Ned Gravel (Discussions: 0, Comments: 49)
Replied on February 6, 2018 7:00 pm
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It is completely clear to me so far. Thank you so much, Sir!
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Posted by Nhat Nguyen Duc (Discussions: 1, Comments: 2)
Replied on February 6, 2018 7:00 pm
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Does the assessor have to watch the entire test being performed? Could the assessor have the analyst expain or walk them through how they perform the test with the assessor using a method checklist and asking the appropriate questions?
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Posted by Scott D. Siders (Discussions: 1, Comments: 1)
Replied on February 8, 2018 7:00 pm
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It is depended, Mr. Scott. So assessor does not have to watch the entire test as long as he or she can be sure that the operator has competence to perform the test and all condition (include equiment, environmetal condition, ...) satisfies with requirements of performing test.
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Posted by Nhat Nguyen Duc (Discussions: 1, Comments: 2)
Replied on February 8, 2018 7:00 pm
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Scott: One of the ways of assessing a test that does not require watching someone move things, and push things, and pour things, is to have a checklist that takes the assessor through the procedure, its validation, the supporting procedures, the equipment, the people, the results, the QA, traceability, sample handling and reporting, and the records associated with these things - all in the space of about an hour.

Going through this, while talking to the technician / analyst will give the assessor a pretty good idea that the lab has the people, with the skills and knowledge; the environment with the facilities and equipment; the QC/QA and QMS; and the procedures required to produce technically valid results (which is the Principle of Capacity behind 17025).

Not hard to do and setting up complicated test equipment for the assessment is not really needed. Having records that demonstrate competence is. And the assessor must be competent in that test as well.
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Posted by Ned Gravel (Discussions: 0, Comments: 49)
Replied on February 9, 2018 7:00 pm
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I agree with Mr Ned Gravel. This is the way I do witnessing of test..watching critical steps of process, questionning, verifying traceability of materials used...etc and having evidence that equipment are in good working conditions , while going through a checklist.
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Posted by Rachel L. (Discussions: 0, Comments: 4)
Replied on February 10, 2018 7:00 pm
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In addition to what is said by Ned, the aim of witness is to evaluate the competence of the Lab. technician to do his specific task and to ensure that his daily routin fulfil the requirements of the standard. Witnessing process also is a mirror that reflect the practical implementation of the written quality procedures.
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Posted by Nabil Harhash (Discussions: 0, Comments: 7)
Replied on February 10, 2018 7:00 pm
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Apart from what have been said above, witnessing the test parameters means the retesting of preserved sample in front of assessors by lab chemist and demonstrating competence of Chemist/ Technician by reporting test value within estimated measurement of uncertainty wrt earlier reported value.
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Posted by Manoj K Tiwari (Discussions: 0, Comments: 2)
Replied on February 10, 2018 7:00 pm
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Dear all, it is good to witness the work, not through all the process. I could feel how lab person is under pressure to do thing according to procedure, even in routine they might not. I will interview to be sure that they understand the concept and consequence of the test.
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Posted by Paramee Kumkrong Pengprecha (Discussions: 0, Comments: 1)
Replied on February 10, 2018 7:00 pm
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